LoginRegister About us Contact us Terms & Conditions

Research Forum

Sarah Luffman BATT
published by daveerasmus on Fri, 16/07/2021 - 17:01

Sarah Luffman BATT was baptised at Congresbury on 13 December 1829. According to the baptism record she was the daughter of Mary BATT “Single woman”.

Mary BATT married Edward PAIN at Wick St Lawrence on 31 March 1831 having previously been married (on 11 June 1816) to Susannah HERVEY who died in about December 1827.

At the time of the 1841 census Edward and Mary PAIN were living in Wick St Lawrence with a number of children from both of Edward’s marriages. Also living with them was Sara PAIN (sic) aged 10.

Sarah Luffman BATT married Francis PARKER at Wick St Lawrence on 15 July 1850. She gave her father’s name as George BATT. I have always harboured the suspicion that Edward PAIN was Sarah’s father. A recent DNA match to a descendant of Edward’s brother has given weight to this theory.

What has always intrigued me is where Sarah’s middle name of Luffman came from. I can’t find anyone of that name amongst the ancestors of either Edward PAIN or Mary BATT. There are a number of LUFFMANs living in Somerset at the time of the 1841 census (for example) but none with an obvious connection to Wick St Lawrence. Nor have I found any BMDs for a LUFFMAN there or nearby between 1700 and 1840.

Any thoughts or theories on the likely origin of the middle name of Luffman would be greatly appreciated.

  login or join us now to post comments

Comments ..

Submitted by Pat Hase on Sun, 18/07/2021 - 12:06

As you know, the most common reason for an unusual second name for an illegitimate child is that it signifies the father's surname.  There is a vague possibility that the Overseers Accounts for Congresbury might have some information about any payment made to support Mary BATT which might name putative father.

When she gave the name George BATT as father - it could be that the clerk assumed the surname was BATT - Have you found a George PAIN in your researching which could support the DNA connection?

   login or join us now to post comments
Submitted by gricharduk on Mon, 19/07/2021 - 9:57

Hi Pat and Dave,

I looked at a few trees on Ancestry and they all give Henry Batt and Mary Shenton as Mary's parents (married at Yatton on 7 May 1805). I was wondering if this might be where things go wrong? I think their marriage is reported on page 4 of the Bath Chronicle and Weekly Gazette, Thursday 16 May 1805 edition. "MARRIED  … At Yatton, Henry Batt, esq; Miss Mary Shenton, of Street, near Glastonbury".

This is quite interesting (and confusing) as it suggests Henry is quite well-off (esquire and a notice in the paper) and that Mary came from Street (whereas most Ancestry trees seem to think she came from Yatton/Kenn or thereabouts). There are numerous Shentons at Street but I could not find a Mary Shenton baptised with anywhere near her supposed birth date.

So, this is probably quite unhelpful (!), but perhaps the Henry Batt and Mary Shenton married at Yatton are not the correct ancestors, and if you did find the right one, then perhaps that middle name might make sense (maiden name of an ancestor?) However, of course, you might have a different/correct ancestor to everyone else!

Best regards,

   login or join us now to post comments
Submitted by gricharduk on Mon, 19/07/2021 - 11:05

I think it is probably Thomas Shenton (Mary's father) that is from Street (baptised 7 October 1739 at Street). So the child is wherever the father comes from - They were strange times.

   login or join us now to post comments
Submitted by daveerasmus on Mon, 19/07/2021 - 20:07

Thank you both for your responses. As ever, there is food for thought in there. I’ll try to deal with each point in turn:

1.     Yes, my original thought was that Luffman was a clue to the true identity of Sarah Luffman BATT’s father. But I couldn’t find anyone that fitted the bill so to speak.

2.     I haven’t been able to find Congresbury Overseers Accounts online. Are they?

3.     Yes, Edward PAIN had a brother called George. He was about 9 years younger. Interestingly two of my DNA matches are to his descendants. But we share very little DNA. So little, that I doubt that George is a direct ancestor of mine. I think it more likely that our most recent common ancestor is a generation or two further back. I have DNA matches with 2 other descendants of Edward PAIN through children born after Edward’s marriage to Mary BATT and I share almost twice as much DNA with them. I recognise that this is not an exact science, but it does seem more likely that Edward, rather than George, is my direct ancestor. What would be helpful is if I could identify a DNA match to someone who is a direct ancestor of Edward through his first marriage.

4.     Mary SHENTON was baptised at Yatton on 12 June 1770. Her brother, Thomas, was baptised the same day. I believe that she was the Mary SHENTON who married Henry BATT at Yatton on 7 May 1805. Henry was buried in Yatton on 16 February1837. Mary was still in Yatton in 1851 and her place of birth was recorded as Kenn.

5.     I have Thomas SHENTON marrying Mary MARCH at Worle on 25 March 1767. According to the marriage record he was “of Kenn”. There is no baptism record for him there. The reference to Street in the newspaper report is intriguing and it does look like the baptism record of 7 October 1739 is probably the right one.

   login or join us now to post comments
Submitted by gricharduk on Tue, 20/07/2021 - 7:03

Thank you for the additional information Dave - I didn't know any of that and it is a really interesting "problem" to research. This doesn't help your search much but it does look like the Shentons were related to the Batts before even Mary Shenton's marriage to Henry Batt. It appears that Mary's father, Thomas Shenton, was the son of John Shenton and Mary Batt, who married at Street on 12 April 1726.

   login or join us now to post comments
Submitted by gricharduk on Tue, 20/07/2021 - 9:53

The last thing I was going to ask was if you knew Mary Payne/Pain (née Batt) had a sister called Sarah? I noticed this on page 2 of the Thursday 24 December 1829 edition of the Devizes and Wiltshire Gazette:

"Sarah Batt, housemaid to Dr. Robertson, of Long Acre, was committed to Newgate, Saturday, from Bow street, for robbing her master of 14 silver table spoons. She acknowledged her guilt, and said she did it to raise a sum of money to pay for nursing an illegitimate child!" [The paper added the exclamation mark]

I was wondering if Mary had "adopted" Sarah Luffman for a family member. I think Sarah got 4 years (ludicrous) and may even have been transported to Australia (it may be the same person - I cannot work it out).

   login or join us now to post comments
Submitted by daveerasmus on Tue, 20/07/2021 - 10:10

Thanks, Richard.

I got back to that same prior connection with the BATTs last night too, before going to bed. It remains to be seen how the 2 lines are connected.

I don't have a sister Sara(h) for Mary. I've checked a few sources and haven't found a likely birth in Yatton, so it looks as if this is a different family. 

   login or join us now to post comments

Is your research stuck?

Use our research forum and

(If you are already a member please login (if not already logged in). If not why not join us now - see the link to the membership page.

Forthcoming Events

Society Committee Meeting
Thursday, 23rd September, 2021 10:00 - 12:00
Zoom Members' Meeting
Thursday, 23rd September, 2021 19:00 - 21:00
Zoom Members' Meeting
Thursday, 21st October, 2021 19:00 - 21:00
Zoom Members' Meeting
Thursday, 18th November, 2021 19:00 - 21:00
Zoom Members' Meeting
Thursday, 16th December, 2021 19:00 - 21:00
<- View calendar for more

Website written and designed by:
Weston IT Solutions
Copyright (c) 2018